Proxmark3 community

PM

Contributor

Registered: 2011-08-15

Posts: 13

[Idiot question] Can we 'write' with Naked Proxmark III ?

Here is the description of Proxmark III :

    - Pre-programmed thorougly tested boards
    - Read & emulate any RFID tag
    - Orders ship within 2 business days

Is it also possible to 'write' an "empty" tag (writable tags), or not, with this device ?

0xFFFF

Administrator

From: Vic - Australia

Registered: 2011-05-31

Posts: 632

Re: [Idiot question] Can we 'write' with Naked Proxmark III ?

Hi PM,

Yes you can. This depends on the type of card you want to program and what you're trying to do. For instance, MiFare you can program without any code changes. Other formats may require a good understanding of the card technology and coding skills.

What card or cards are you interested in programming? Can you provide more detail?

Regards,

-0xFFFF

PM

Contributor

Registered: 2011-08-15

Posts: 13

Re: [Idiot question] Can we 'write' with Naked Proxmark III ?

Thank you for your answer.

I'm just curious I want to learn how this technology works, and I know the best way is to see or make it by myself.
I'm looking for a device which can interact with different TAGs.

This year, I developped some programs to interact with embedded hardware (sensors), but a SDK was available for all functionnalities. That's not the same thing here.

I have no knowledge of electronics (or very low), but I understand/though that's not necessary. If the firmware allow me to read/write bytes, it will be great. If it can be more complicated, but possible, i will be a (long ?) challenge (other ISOs source codes could help me)

I just want to ensure that I can get all hardware requirements from Proxmark III (read/write)

If i'm on the wrong way, tell me now

Thank you, and sorry for my bad english

0xFFFF

Administrator

From: Vic - Australia

Registered: 2011-05-31

Posts: 632

Re: [Idiot question] Can we 'write' with Naked Proxmark III ?

Glad I could help

I'm just curious I want to learn how this technology works, and I know the best way is to see or make it by myself.
I'm looking for a device which can interact with different TAGs.

The Proxmark III will certainly help you get a better understanding of how the various NFC technologies work. Other tools would require a greater understanding of electronics.
Are you familiar with JTAG?

This year, I developped some programs to interact with embedded hardware (sensors), but a SDK was available for all functionnalities. That's not the same thing here.

As you're already aware this project is open source. You can see what makes the Proxmark 'tick' simply by reviewing what has already been done. I'd suggest familiarizing yourself with the project and seeing if you are comfortable with what you see. If you don't understand anything, ask a few questions in this forum to see if investing in the Proxmark will be worth your while.

I have no knowledge of electronics (or very low), but I understand/though that's not necessary. If the firmware allow me to read/write bytes, it will be great. If it can be more complicated, but possible, i will be a (long ?) challenge (other ISOs source codes could help me)

I think that if you have little or no understanding of electronics, you will likely experience a lot of technical headaches. As I said before - Have a look at the project source and see if you can familiarize your self with what is going on inside the Proxmark.
I'd suggest looking up Standards, Technical Notes and other information from manufacturers of some of the more popular NFC devices.

I just want to ensure that I can get all hardware requirements from Proxmark III (read/write)

The Proxmark III definitely reads and writes data. It does a LOT more than that. It is the most powerful device of its kind (I've tested quite a few).

The impression that I get is that you will have a lot of technical difficulty understanding the product and how to make good use of it. I would strongly recommend doing some research on 'RFID tags', 'Near Field Communication'. A good ISO standard to start reading is 14443.

When you're ready, I'd suggest getting a pre-assembled Proxmark (if you're not familiar with electronics). I'd also suggest getting pre-assembled high and low frequency antennas. All of these things are attainable from http://proxmark3.com/ or http://hackable-devices.org/products/product/proxmark3/. It will cost you a bit but you'll have piece of mind knowing the Proxmark has been tested and has firmware been loaded.

I hope this helps.

-0xFFFF

PM

Contributor

Registered: 2011-08-15

Posts: 13

Re: [Idiot question] Can we 'write' with Naked Proxmark III ?

Thanks to you for all theses precisions.

I'm taking a look at ISO 14443-1/4 standard documents.

Are antennas necessary for 1-2 cm reading ? (here is any "micro-antenna" into pre-assembled Proxmark3 device ? Or couldn't be itself an antenna for very low distance)

I'm also looking for an enclosure, but I don't now the exact size of the device (I readed "Size of a card set", but I find it a kinda small), but that's another subject.

I'm going to read some posts in this forum, and I will take my time to understand how it works.

Thank you for your help. I note your advice.

0xFFFF

Administrator

From: Vic - Australia

Registered: 2011-05-31

Posts: 632

Re: [Idiot question] Can we 'write' with Naked Proxmark III ?

I'm not sure if the antenna could be built in to the Proxmark III PCB. There might be technical limitations. I'm no good with the analogue / radio portion of the Proxmark so I have used an external antenna.

Standard ISO cards are 85.60 × 53.98 mm (common ID-1 format).
The Proxmark is 81.3 x 51.6 x 13 mm. So it is actually slightly smaller!
The smallest antenna I'm aware of is one of the antennas for the HID OEM75. The 3144 is 24 x 38 mm.
Most antennas can read up to an absolute maximum of about 50mm. The limitation varies due to the different NFC technology types and the antenna construction.

Here's my Proxmark next to a card and antenna:

**Forgot to add:
To make an LF antenna on a budget, disassemble a 125kHz proximity card and use the coil in the card as the antenna. I've had very good results from this.

Regards,

-0xFFFF